Startup Wrap – Saudi VC space continues to play pivotal role in SMEs growth as Biban 24 delivers deals

Startup Wrap – Saudi VC space continues to play pivotal role in SMEs growth as Biban 24 delivers deals
’s signature startup event Biban 24 saw deals worth more than $5 billion signed to support SMEs. SPA
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Updated 08 November 2024

Startup Wrap – Saudi VC space continues to play pivotal role in SMEs growth as Biban 24 delivers deals

Startup Wrap – Saudi VC space continues to play pivotal role in SMEs growth as Biban 24 delivers deals

RIYADH: ’s venture capital ecosystem continues to boost the regional startup space, with one company plowing $20 million into the early stage-focused Booster IV fund.

Saudi Venture Capital Co. announced it was pouring the money into the fund, which is managed by Beco Capital and focuses on investments across the Gulf region.

Booster IV aims to support high-growth or disruptive startups, targeting companies from the seed stage up to series A. 

The fund’s investment strategy spans various sectors with a strong emphasis on and the broader Gulf region, and currently oversees $495 million in assets across four funds.

“Our investment in Booster IV, managed by Beco Capital, aligns with our fund investment program and our strategy to support funds that back early stage startups in ,” said Nabeel Koshak, CEO and board member of SVC.

Established in 2018, SVC is a subsidiary of the SME Bank, part of ’s National Development Fund.

The company is dedicated to stimulating and sustaining financing for startups and small and medium-sized enterprises, supporting them from the pre-seed stage up to pre-IPO through funding and co-investments in high-potential startups.

Saudi’s BIM Ventures and Japan’s SBI Holdings launch $2bn-targeted BIM Capital




Supplied.

-based venture studio BIM Ventures and Japan’s SBI Holdings have launched a joint venture aiming to drive growth across and the broader Middle East.

BIM Capital’s investment strategy spans private equity, venture capital, debt funds, and real estate development, with a target of attracting over $200 million in foreign direct investment and managing assets exceeding $2 billion.

The firm will leverage its expertise to identify high-growth sectors, with a particular emphasis on technology ventures, emerging industries, and real estate development, offering investors access to innovative, transformative opportunities.

Mush Social raises $1.2m in pre-seed funding led by Nifal Consulting

Saudi-based Mush Social has closed a $1.2 million pre-seed funding round led by Nifal Consulting, with support from Nahr Al-Jazeera Holding and angel investors.

Founded in 2022 by Abdulhadi Al-Asmi, Mush Social operates a social platform where users can earn points and own virtual assets through its interactive map feature, potentially monetizing their online interactions.

The funds will support the development of advanced technologies to enhance user value from their engagements on the platform.

Ayen acquires Egyptian contech Elmawkaa in seven-figure deal




The deal will see Ayen integrate Elmawkaa’s construction materials marketplace into its property evaluation platform. Supplied

Saudi property tech company Ayen has acquired Egyptian construction technology firm Elmawkaa in a seven-figure Saudi riyal transaction.

Founded in 2018 by Abdulrahman Al-Mulqi, Ali Al-Mohsen, and Aymen Al-Sarory, Ayen provides data-driven property evaluation solutions.

The acquisition will integrate Elmawkaa’s construction materials marketplace into Ayen’s platform, strengthening its market position across the Gulf Cooperation Council region.

Elmawkaa, established in 2017, offers a digital marketplace for competitive quotations on building materials, aimed at streamlining procurement for construction companies.

Aramco Ventures backs IOTA Software’s $10.4m series A2 round

Aramco Ventures has joined a $10.4 million Series A2 funding round for IOTA Software, a cloud-native platform for industrial performance optimization, led by Altira Group with participation from Oxy Technology Ventures and Second Avenue Partners.

The funds will enable IOTA to expand its engineering, product, and customer success teams, enhance its technology infrastructure, and strengthen marketing efforts. IOTA’s platform aggregates business and operations data to aid decision-making across industrial sectors.

Warburg AI secures $250k in seed funding for financial AI solutions

UAE-based Warburg AI has raised $250,000 in seed funding from undisclosed investors.

Founded in 2024 by Ben Pfeffer, Lancelot De Briey, and Madiyar Ismagulov, Warburg AI develops adaptive artificial intelligence and machine learning tools for financial institutions, with a focus on algorithmic trading, real-time risk management, and asset optimization.

The capital will be directed toward product development and expansion of its customer solutions team.

Brands.io raises seed funding to expand AI-focused domain services

UAE’s Brands.io, an AI-driven domain name provider, has raised an undisclosed amount in seed funding from unnamed investors.

Founded in 2024 by Chetan Gera, Brands.io offers customized domain names tailored for AI companies. 

The investment will fuel platform development, add technical features, and support the company’s expansion into Europe, the Middle East, and Africa, with a strong focus on strengthening its GCC presence.

NorthLadder raises $10m in series B for expansion in pre-owned electronics market




NorthLadder aims to capitalize on the increasing demand in the expanding pre-owned smartphone market. Supplied

UAE-based NorthLadder, a trade-in platform for pre-owned electronics, has raised $10 million in a Series B funding round led by stc Group’s corporate venture capital arm, tali ventures, with additional contributions from the Dutch Founders Fund and Crescent Ventures.

Founded in 2021 by Mihin Shah and Sandeep Shetty, NorthLadder offers a secure platform for reselling pre-owned devices, addressing growing demand in this sector.

With the new capital, NorthLadder plans to enhance its technology and expand its presence, particularly in Europe.

CE-Ventures co-leads $10m funding round for CrossBridge Bio’s cancer therapies

UAE-based CE-Ventures, the corporate venture capital arm of Crescent Enterprises, has co-led a $10 million funding round for CrossBridge Bio, a Houston-based biotech firm focused on developing dual-payload antibody drug conjugates for targeted cancer treatments.

The round also included participation from TMC Venture Fund, Portal Innovations, Alexandria Ventures, and several pre-seed investors.

The investment will support the advancement of CrossBridge Bio’s lead candidate, CBB-120, which targets solid tumors.

Additionally, the funding will enable the company to expand its pipeline of dual-payload ADCs and further develop its proprietary linker technology, which it claims could bring a new level of precision to cancer therapy.

’s signature startup event Biban 24 sees deals to support SMEs

Biban 24, ’s premier event for startups and SMEs, saw over $5 billion in agreements and financing initiatives signed during the first three days.

Organized by the General Authority for Small and Medium Enterprises, or Monsha’at, the Riyadh-based forum secured more than 40 agreements and numerous financing portfolios aimed at bolstering ’s SME sector in alignment with Vision 2030 goals.

These deals, amounting to more than SR18 billion ($4.79 billion) on the first day, SR1.35 billion on the second,  and SR580 million on day three,  included partnerships with leading Saudi banks, international memoranda of understanding, and investment opportunities designed to enhance access to funding and expand support networks for SMEs.

The event, themed “A Global Destination for Opportunities,” underscores Monsha’at’s commitment to creating a conducive environment for SMEs to thrive, positioning them as key drivers of economic diversification.


Pakistan signs $4.5 billion loans with local banks to ease power sector debt

Pakistan signs $4.5 billion loans with local banks to ease power sector debt
Updated 21 June 2025

Pakistan signs $4.5 billion loans with local banks to ease power sector debt

Pakistan signs $4.5 billion loans with local banks to ease power sector debt
  • The government, which owns much of the power infrastructure, is grappling with ballooning ‘circular debt’
  • The liquidity crunch has disrupted supply, discouraged investment and added to fiscal pressure on Islamabad

KARACHI: Pakistan has signed term sheets with 18 commercial banks for a 1.275 trillion Pakistani rupee ($4.50 billion) Islamic finance facility to help pay down mounting debt in its power sector, government officials said on Friday.

The government, which owns or controls much of the power infrastructure, is grappling with ballooning “circular debt”, unpaid bills and subsidies, that has choked the sector and weighed on the economy.

The liquidity crunch has disrupted supply, discouraged investment and added to fiscal pressure, making it a key focus under Pakistan’s $7 billion IMF program.

Finding funds to plug the gap has been a persistent challenge, with limited fiscal space and high-cost legacy debt making resolution efforts more difficult.

“Eighteen commercial banks will provide the loans through Islamic financing,” Khurram Schehzad, adviser to the finance minister, told Reuters.

The facility, structured under Islamic principles, is secured at a concessional rate of 3-month KIBOR, the benchmark rate banks use to price loans, minus 0.9 percent, a formula agreed on by the IMF.

“It will be repaid in 24 quarterly instalments over six years,” and will not add to public debt, Power Minister Awais Leghari said.

Existing liabilities carry higher costs, including late payment surcharges on Independent Power Producers of up to KIBOR plus 4.5 percent, and older loans ranging slightly above benchmark rates.

Meezan Bank, HBL, National Bank of Pakistan and UBL were among the banks participating in the deal.

The government expects to allocate 323 billion rupees annually to repay the loan, capped at 1.938 trillion rupees over six years.

The agreement also aligns with Pakistan’s target of eliminating interest-based banking by 2028, with Islamic finance now comprising about a quarter of total banking assets.


Saudi gold demand defies price surge amid cultural, digital shift

Saudi gold demand defies price surge amid cultural, digital shift
Updated 20 June 2025

Saudi gold demand defies price surge amid cultural, digital shift

Saudi gold demand defies price surge amid cultural, digital shift

RIYADH: Gold prices may be at record highs, but that has not stopped Saudi consumers from buying. In the first quarter of 2025, demand for gold jewelry in the Kingdom jumped 35 percent year on year, even as global demand fell 21 percent, according to the World Gold Council.

That surge comes amid a global price rally, with gold breaching $3,500 per ounce in April, up from around $2,370 a year earlier — driven by geopolitical tensions, inflation fears, and aggressive central bank buying. 

“This rapid increase in the price of the bullion can be attributed to one main reason – central bank buying,” Vijay Valecha, chief investment officer at Century Financial, told Arab News. 

Yet despite the soaring cost, ’s deep-rooted gold culture continues to shine, with consumers purchasing 11.5 tonnes of gold jewelry in the first quarter, up from 8.5 tonnes a year earlier.

“This feat occurred despite the 34 percent rise in prices in early 2025, demonstrating Saudi consumers’ strong demand and purchasing power,” said Valecha.

Vijay Valecha, chief investment officer at Century Financial. Supplied

Gold in the Kingdom is more than a financial asset — it represents tradition, adornment, and intergenerational wealth. From bullion bars to minimalist 18-carat jewelry, Saudi buyers are proving resilient even as other regional markets, such as the UAE and Kuwait, witness sharp declines in demand.

Hamza Dweik, head of trading for the MENA region at Saxo Bank, emphasized gold’s cultural role, telling Arab News: “Gold is deeply embedded in Saudi traditions, especially during weddings and festive occasions. This cultural attachment ensures a steady baseline of demand, even during price surges.”

Global factors

Valecha explained that following the conflict in Ukraine, many countries grew concerned about holding excessive reserves in US dollars, prompting nations such as China and Russia to increase their gold purchases.

“China has spearheaded record levels of global central bank purchases of gold. Hence, looking ahead, the trend of gold buying by central banks is expected to continue,” he added.

​​Another push came in May, when Moody’s downgraded the US credit rating from Aaa to Aa1, citing “a sustained increase in government debt (exceeding $36 trillion), rising interest payment ratios, and persistent fiscal deficits exacerbated by political dysfunction and policy uncertainty.”

Valecha added that this marked the first time the US lost its top-tier rating from all three major agencies. 

Cultural drivers

In different parts of the Kingdom, people buy gold for different reasons. In the north, around 70 percent of buyers view gold primarily as an investment, while in the south, it is more closely tied to tradition and adornment. Gold bars and coins are also gaining popularity, with people stocking their safes with bars of varying weights and purity.

In the first quarter, gold demand in grew 15 percent year on year to 4.4 tonnes. Jewelry preferences are also shifting — from favoring diamonds to a growing obsession with gold.

More young buyers are opting for 18-carat pieces due to their affordability, modern style, and lighter tone, as they appear less yellow than 21- and 24-carat gold.

“They also have a less flashy design/colour, which makes them better for everyday use,” Valecha explained.

Hamza Dweik, head of trading for the MENA region at Saxo Bank. Supplied

Digital platforms and online gold purchases are also on the rise, blending tradition with technology — from buying fractional gold and using savings apps to investing through exchange-traded funds.

“Younger generations are blending tradition with technology — embracing digital gold platforms, fractional ownership, and ETFs, while still participating in cultural gifting. This is reshaping how gold is marketed and consumed,” Dweik added.

While countries including the UAE and Kuwait have seen gold demand decline, is moving in the opposite direction, with domestic consumers leading the surge, supported by strong spending habits.

Consumer spending in the Kingdom hit an all-time high in March, rising 17 percent to SR148 billion ($39.44 billion) — the highest monthly increase since May 2021 — before easing to SR113.9 billion in April.

The shift in consumer behavior is evident across the Kingdom. Jewelers in Riyadh spoken to by Arab News reported a growing interest in custom pieces, lighter-weight ornaments, and contemporary designs that suit both festive occasions and everyday wear. 

The 18-carat trend, once seen as a budget-friendly option, has become a fashion choice, according to the jewelers. More women are purchasing gold for themselves, breaking away from the traditional gift-only narrative. 

While physical stores remain popular for high-value purchases, particularly during wedding seasons and religious festivals, digital platforms are making inroads. Online retailers like L’azurde are adapting to this demand by offering buy-now-pay-later plans, making gold more accessible to a wider audience. Popular jewelry items include 21-carat necklaces and rings, while younger buyers favor 18-carat pieces for daily wear.

Market outlook

Looking ahead, both Valecha and Dweik expect prices to remain strong. Valecha predicts gold could reach $3,700 per ounce by year-end, though he cautions short-term investors. “Buyers should assess their investment horizon — long-term holders may still find value, while short-term buyers should be mindful of volatility,” he said.

“Sustained central bank purchases, heightened investor appetite in a period of uncertainty in the economic landscape, and projected interest rate cuts drive this bullish projection. The projected price under a recession scenario is as high as $3,880 per ounce,” Valecha added.

Dweik agreed, and said: “While structural drivers support continued growth, potential corrections could occur if inflation eases or interest rates rise.”

may also be poised to grow into a regional gold trading hub. Valecha believes that with the right infrastructure and regulatory framework, the Kingdom could play a larger role in the global market. “To elevate its status, a modern, transparent gold market ecosystem and enhanced refining capabilities would be essential,” he said.

With deep-rooted traditions, rising investment activity, and a modernized retail environment, ’s gold market is not only resilient — it is evolving. In a time of global uncertainty, gold continues to shine across the Kingdom.


Where the money is flowing: AI, agritech, and fintech set to lead Saudi venture capital ecosystem

Where the money is flowing: AI, agritech, and fintech set to lead Saudi venture capital ecosystem
Updated 20 June 2025

Where the money is flowing: AI, agritech, and fintech set to lead Saudi venture capital ecosystem

Where the money is flowing: AI, agritech, and fintech set to lead Saudi venture capital ecosystem

RIYADH: ’s venture capital ecosystem is entering a pivotal phase of growth, fueled by a surge in domestic and international investment targeting sectors aligned with the Kingdom’s Vision 2030.

Agriculture tech, fintech, artificial intelligence, and clean energy are emerging as key pillars of this transformation, driven by regulatory reforms, demographic shifts, and a rising global investor appetite.

The country’s ambition to become a regional innovation hub is drawing sustained capital inflows, placing it at the center of the broader emerging venture market investment narrative.

Domestic ambition shapes sectoral disposition

Said Murad, senior partner at investment firm Global Ventures, cited ’s high food import dependency and its ambitions to boost domestic production as key in drawing funds to the Kingdom.

“Agritech and climate-related technologies will certainly contribute to the next phase of investment growth,” he told Arab News in an interview.

Complementing this trend, Philip Bahoshy, CEO of MAGNiTT, pointed to fintech, AI, clean energy, logistics, and advanced manufacturing as areas expected to dominate future funding.

“These sectors align with Vision 2030’s push for economic diversification and digital transformation,” he told Arab News, with health tech and deep tech also gaining traction due to increasing research and development support and regulatory tailwinds.

Philip Bahoshy, CEO of MAGNiTT. Supplied

AI, in particular, is emerging as a dominant investment theme in the region. According to MAGNiTT’s 2025 predictions, the sector is set to double its share of venture capital funding in emerging venture markets this year, following a surge of high-profile deals in 2024.

“AI was the main driver of investment activity both in the private and public markets in the US and other mature markets in 2024,” the platform noted, referencing data from PitchBook.

In the first nine months of 2024, AI accounted for 41.3 percent of US venture capital funding. In , this momentum is reflected in deals such as Intelmatix’s $20 million Series A round and Amazon Web Services’s planned data center investment, both signaling the Kingdom’s rising stake in the global AI landscape.

MAGNiTT also cited broader geopolitical and commercial developments in the AI space, including chip export agreements, as indicators of the sector’s rising importance in the region.

“Based on our proprietary data, we expect AI funding to double in 2025 due to increased investor attention to innovative AI startups,” the company stated.

Beyond AI, Global Ventures’ investment in Iyris, an agritech company spun out of King Abdullah University of Science and Technology, illustrates the potential of local innovation to address long-standing structural challenges.

“Iyris is positively disrupting agricultural practices for mid-to-low-tech farmers, particularly in hot climates,” Murad said.

The startup launched the National Food Production Initiative in 2023, partnering with SABIC and Red Sea Global to establish a sustainable farming project in Bada, , aimed at regenerating unproductive land and enhancing food security.

Fintech remains another strong area of interest, supported by a digitally connected population and a push toward financial inclusion.

“With 98 percent internet penetration and 97 percent smartphone adoption among the 18-to-78-year age group, the Kingdom has one of the world’s most digitally enabled populations,” Murad said.

He views this as a key enabler for innovation in financial services, both consumer-facing and enterprise-driven.

Focused sectors, broad appeal

Capital inflows into are being driven not only by sector performance but also by global institutional interest in the region.

According to MAGNiTT, firms including BlackRock, Golden Gate Ventures, and Polen Capital have already established offices or acquired licenses in the Kingdom, the UAE, or Qatar.

Others, including General Catalyst and the BRICS Investment Fund, have made their investment debuts or launched dedicated MENA-focused funds.

“In 2025, we expect even more investors and asset managers to set up offices in the EVM regions, particularly and the UAE,” MAGNiTT stated, attributing this to the region’s “friendly business-enabling environment.”

Said Murad, senior partner at investment firm Global Ventures. Supplied

Deal flow in the Kingdom has grown across all funding stages. “ saw a surge in pre-seed and seed-stage funding,” said Murad, noting that demand for later-stage capital is increasing as startups validate their models and seek international expansion.

Supporting this trajectory is a growing exit pipeline. In 2024, completed 42 initial public offerings, ranking seventh globally in capital raised.

“This growing pipeline of exits signals the increasing maturity of the country’s capital markets and reinforces the long-term viability of its venture ecosystem,” Murad added.

As international capital intensifies, local venture firms are adapting their strategies to remain competitive.

“Regional players active in the market will understand local nuances, ultimately providing a competitive advantage,” Murad said.

He emphasized that investors offering operational support and showcasing portfolio success stories will be best positioned to attract international limited partners.

The Kingdom’s regulatory environment is increasingly seen as a strength in the region’s venture capital narrative.

“Government initiatives and the regulatory framework are geared to venture capital firms investing in startups in a secure, forward-thinking, and robust environment,” Murad said.

Still, he cautioned that strong business fundamentals remain essential. “The need for entrepreneurs to have strong, sustainable business models with good unit economics is as necessary as ever,” said the Global Ventures partner.

Despite global uncertainties, Saudi entrepreneurs may be better equipped than most to navigate a challenging macroeconomic environment.

“At Global Ventures, we refer to the ‘adversity advantage’— a natural upside for regional entrepreneurs who are used to working with, and around, resource scarcity,” Murad said.

“This has empowered them, by design, to build businesses more resilient and adaptable to challenges,” he added.


Oil Updates — prices fall as US delays decision on direct Iran involvement

Oil Updates — prices fall as US delays decision on direct Iran involvement
Updated 20 June 2025

Oil Updates — prices fall as US delays decision on direct Iran involvement

Oil Updates — prices fall as US delays decision on direct Iran involvement

SINGAPORE: Oil prices fell on Friday after the White House delayed a decision on US involvement in the Israel-Iran conflict yet they remained on course for a third consecutive weekly rise.

Brent crude futures were down $2.57, or around 3.3 percent, to $76.28 a barrel by 3:04 p.m. Saudi time but still set to gain nearly 3 percent on the week.

US West Texas Intermediate crude for July — which did not settle on Thursday as it was a US holiday and expires on Friday — was up marginally at $75.19.

The more liquid August contract was up around 0.4 percent, or 31 cents, to $73.19.

On Thursday prices jumped almost 3 percent after Israel bombed nuclear targets in Iran, while Iran — OPEC’s third-largest producer — fired missiles and drones at Israel. Neither side showed any sign of backing down in the week-old war.

Brent prices retreated after the White House said President Donald Trump would decide whether the US will get involved in the Israel-Iran conflict in the next two weeks.

“However, while Israel and Iran carry on pounding away at each other there can always be an unintended action that escalates the conflict and touches upon oil infrastructure,” PVM analyst John Evans said.

Iran has in the past threatened to close the Strait of Hormuz, a vital route for Middle East oil exports.

However, oil exports so far have not been disrupted and there is no shortage of supply, said Giovanni Staunovo, an analyst at UBS.

“The direction of oil prices from here will depend on whether there are supply disruptions.”

An escalation of the conflict in such a way that Israel attacks export infrastructure or Iran disrupts shipping through the strait could lead to $100 per barrel of oil being a reality, said Panmure Liberum analyst Ashley Kelty.


OPEC+ has proven to be oil markets’ central bank, says Saudi energy minister

OPEC+ has proven to be oil markets’ central bank, says Saudi energy minister
Updated 19 June 2025

OPEC+ has proven to be oil markets’ central bank, says Saudi energy minister

OPEC+ has proven to be oil markets’ central bank, says Saudi energy minister

RIYADH: OPEC+ has proven to be the “central bank” and regulator of the global oil market, providing much-needed stability, ’s energy minister said.

Speaking at the annual St. Petersburg International Economic Forum in Russia, Prince Abdulaziz bin Salman praised the alliance’s role in balancing oil markets amid global economic uncertainties.

“I would have to say that OPEC+ had proven to be an instrument that if it wasn’t invented by us and Russia and our colleagues, it should have been invented a long time ago because this is what OPEC+ had achieved in terms of bringing stability to the market and had proven that it is the central bank and the regulator of oil markets,” the energy minister said.

Prince Abdulaziz also highlighted the ongoing partnership between and Russia through the Saudi-Russian Joint Committee, noting plans for Russian Deputy Prime Minister Alexander Novak to visit the Kingdom later this year with a high-level business delegation.

“I’m looking forward to host Alexander — the co-chair of our joint committee — to this year, with the biggest, most sizable business community participation,” he said.

Prince Abdulaziz emphasized that the collaboration seeks to deepen bilateral economic ties and foster diversified investment opportunities.

“We have a lot to showcase that bonding together. It will allow us to have a much more diversified relationship, and we are, as a government, working together to provide the right environment for those who want to invest in or in Russia or in any type or form of joint venturing that we should facilitate that and ensure that the investment environment is congenial for it to happen,” he added.

The minister described the energy alliance as a flexible mechanism responsive to changing global conditions, reaffirming ’s commitment to cooperation with partners to maintain market stability.

Acknowledging the challenges facing Russia, Prince Abdulaziz noted the Kingdom’s support amid external restrictions.

“It’s been a challenging time what Russia is going through, but we have shown a great deal of understanding of the situation, and we’re trying to maneuver with the restrictions that are existing today,” he said.

“That has been the discharge of our leadership willingness to accommodate with this current situation and hopefully helping to support Russia in mitigating these exterior most daunting issues.”

On whether and Russia would compensate for any loss of Iranian crude supplies, the minister stressed that such scenarios are hypothetical and that OPEC+ decisions are collective.

“You give me a question that is not evidently seen happening, I don’t have an answer for you. Again, we only react to realities. But if anybody gives a question that is not relating to the reality today, I fail to see where we could predict things and how we would relate to it,” he said.

The minister clarified that OPEC+ consists of 22 member states and is not dominated by and Russia alone. A core group of eight countries is tasked with engaging the full membership to ensure coordinated responses to market changes.

“To respond to a hypothetical question by giving a hypothetical answer, which none of us two here have the right to speak on behalf of everybody without knowing their opinion, is too much of an ask,” he added.

He concluded by highlighting OPEC+’s reputation as a reliable and adaptive organization.

“What we know and what Alexander was saying just a while ago is that we have, as OPEC even before, an OPEC+ attending to so many circumstances since its first, it was in sequence, even inception, that we have been a reliable organization, a serious organization, an effective organization, and attentive to circumstances when they prevail,” he said.